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bollocks! You didn't hate Robson and Pearce, you're a fcuking Englishman, so i've now exposed you as a lying git. By the way it is ok to give your own players criticism, i won't think any less of you

QBVILLA wrote:bollocks! You didn't hate Robson and Pearce, you're a fcuking Englishman, so i've now exposed you as a lying git. By the way it is ok to give your own players criticism, i won't think any less of you

Look back through my posts. I criticise when it's warrented but I really don't have a problem with Cesc.
I think Robson is one of the most overrated players I have seen. In my opinion the best thing he ever did for England was to dislocate his shoulder in the world cup in Mexico, at the same time as Wilkins was suspended. Without those two 'linchpins' our performance improved dramatically, we looked a different team and we reached the last eight.
You made a remark on the Villa board about players not being given a chance and you felt that Downing has been treated less tolerantly than other players who fans almost have a blind faith in. I really believe that Robson was one of those players he had a reputation way above his status. You hear a lot of past players talked about but rarely Robson. He just was not that good.

Oh and by the way,

I'm not having that, Robson was one of the finest central midfielders in the 80s, you don't like him because you are gay

QBVILLA wrote:I'm not having that, Robson was one of the finest central midfielders in the 80s, you don't like him because you are gay

I thought he was a winger.

SORRY!!! I meant MINGER.

QB, I think Jak is on about the Bryan 'pop' Robson who played up front for Newcastle and West Ham in the 1970's.

Robson was a top midfielder, though remember being at the Hawthorns when Atkinson played him as a sweeper behind the centre backs of Wile and Robertson. One of the best performances I have ever seen from a defender.

jpr60 wrote:

Tilton wrote:

jpr60 wrote:If our captain is not allowed to question the ref/linesman who is?
I don't recall the likes of Roy Keane, John Terry etc holding back when they didn't agree with e refereeing decision and last night's decision-making was pretty poor throughout, especially, of course allowing an offside goal.
I want Cesc to fight our cause - he gets criticism for not being a "real leader" on the pitch - as captain he has the right to talk to the ref and if it includes telling him he's a load of bollox, well so be it. The lad cares - so do I!

You raised the issue of respect in another thread.

Do you think that Fabregas shows respect towards officials on and off the field of play? Either by his seemingly constant questioning of decisions, abuse aimed towards them and attempts to fool them by diving to gain unfair advantages?

Do you think that Fabregas shows respect for his fellow professionals by brandishing imaginary cards and trying to get them booked? Or again by diving etc.?

Undoubtedly he's an excellent footballer but as captain of Arsenal he doesn't set a great example in my opinion.

Since we don't know what "abuse" Fabregas is supposed to have used to the "officials" last night I'm not about to make any judgement - all I know is the match officials were p!ss poor and we could have been giving ManU another two or three points advantage at the top of the table as a result of their inability to control the match properly.
Yes, Fabregas made the card signal to the ref against Huddersfield, probably because one of his team had been shown a red card for an apparent last-ditch foul early in the game whereas a Huddersfield player, stopping Bendtner illegally in the penalty area was allowed to remain on the pitch - that's consistency right there. However, I agree it's not something I like to see but, again, it's understandable given the circumstances.
Diving? Well I wouldn't say Fabregas "dives", he went down a little easy against Birmingham but, then again he wasn't appealing for a pen so maybe he lost his footing as a challenge came in.
As captain of Arsenal Fabregas has the responsibility of looking after stuff on the field of play. If he's fighting for us I'm happy, if he's keeping schtum and letting everyone get away with whatever I'm not happy. I'm happy with Captain Cesc!

QB - I did "address" Tilton's over-the-top criticism of our brilliant captain - there it is, "addressed" before your suggestion that I didn't, if you see what I mean!

I don't think that there was anything "over-the-top" about my post.

I bet you'd find that the majority of football fans (except Arsenal obviously) throughout the country would have a similar opinion - great footballer but a bit of a cock.

Tilton wrote:I don't think that there was anything "over-the-top" about my post.

I bet you'd find that the majority of football fans (except Arsenal obviously) throughout the country would have a similar opinion - great footballer but a bit of a cock.

Perhaps, but since most of them won't have seen him play they'd be getting their opinions from the likes of Phil Brown, Mark Hughes and now Moyes, backed by the press who love to have a poke at a player, especially if he's not out on the lash every night, doesn't beat his girlfriend up, doesn't wreck expensive cars and, oh yes, is foreign.
For those who criticise excellent players like Cesc Fabregas I would say - get a life!

jpr60 wrote:
For those who criticise excellent players like Cesc Fabregas I would say - get a life!

Why? Ronaldo is a superb player, it still doesn't stop him been a massive twat.

No doubt that Fabregas a superb player, but to say people cant criticise him as he is an excellent player is absolutely ridiculous.

Maradona, arguably the greatest player of all time. I suppose it's not right to criticise him for being a coked-up cheating fat little gimp then?

Ezekiel 25:17 wrote:Maradona, arguably the greatest player of all time. I suppose it's not right to criticise him for being a coked-up cheating fat little gimp then?

Apart from Pele, Cruyff, Zidane and Messi.

Arguably being the key word.

Ezekiel 25:17 wrote:Arguably being the key word.

should've read 'arguably the fifth best player of all time'. I guess you mis-typed whilst listening the Weezer?

villainies wrote:

Ezekiel 25:17 wrote:Arguably being the key word.

should've read 'arguably the fifth best player of all time'. I guess you mis-typed whilst listening the Weezer?

You been on the special brownies, Swampy?

Ezekiel 25:17 wrote:

villainies wrote:

Ezekiel 25:17 wrote:Arguably being the key word.

should've read 'arguably the fifth best player of all time'. I guess you mis-typed whilst listening the Weezer?

You been on the special brownies, Swampy?

Never before 5pm.

jpr60 wrote:

Tilton wrote:I don't think that there was anything "over-the-top" about my post.

I bet you'd find that the majority of football fans (except Arsenal obviously) throughout the country would have a similar opinion - great footballer but a bit of a cock.

Perhaps, but since most of them won't have seen him play they'd be getting their opinions from the likes of Phil Brown, Mark Hughes and now Moyes, backed by the press who love to have a poke at a player, especially if he's not out on the lash every night, doesn't beat his girlfriend up, doesn't wreck expensive cars and, oh yes, is foreign.
For those who criticise excellent players like Cesc Fabregas I would say - get a life!

Why do you think that most of them won't have seen him play?

That's a very strange statement considering the amount of televised and online coverage that's available these days. You don't honestly believe that, do you?

As for the criticism - I don't think that anybody questions his footballing ability. It's the rest of the stuff he does that shows him up to be a cock.

Just because he's an excellent footballer doesn't mean that he should be immune from criticism for the bad things he does. Even from you.

I would suggest that somebody willing to blindly defend him just because he plays for Arsenal is the one who should contemplate getting a life.

Tilton wrote:

jpr60 wrote:

Tilton wrote:I don't think that there was anything "over-the-top" about my post.

I bet you'd find that the majority of football fans (except Arsenal obviously) throughout the country would have a similar opinion - great footballer but a bit of a cock.

Perhaps, but since most of them won't have seen him play they'd be getting their opinions from the likes of Phil Brown, Mark Hughes and now Moyes, backed by the press who love to have a poke at a player, especially if he's not out on the lash every night, doesn't beat his girlfriend up, doesn't wreck expensive cars and, oh yes, is foreign.
For those who criticise excellent players like Cesc Fabregas I would say - get a life!

Why do you think that most of them won't have seen him play?

That's a very strange statement considering the amount of televised and online coverage that's available these days. You don't honestly believe that, do you?

As for the criticism - I don't think that anybody questions his footballing ability. It's the rest of the stuff he does that shows him up to be a cock.

Just because he's an excellent footballer doesn't mean that he should be immune from criticism for the bad things he does. Even from you.

I would suggest that somebody willing to blindly defend him just because he plays for Arsenal is the one who should contemplate getting a life.

Watching a match live is a whole lot different from watching on TV, as you will certainly know. In a live game you can see what's going on, on and off the ball all the time. On TV you get the bits that the camera has covered, usually the on-ball action and our pundit friends then have the chance to highlight the bits that they've chosen for our "education". What I'm saying there is that not a lot of people will have actually seen Fabregas playing football.
What exactly has Fabregas done that is so objectionable, that's what I don't get? He had a run-in with Phil Brown who accused him of wearing a hood (amongst other terrible things), he had a go at Mark Hughes once which, IMO is fair enough - the man has proved himself to be a cnut on many occasions, both in his playing career and as a manager. Now Moyes has been shocked by the language that he is supposed to have used to the match officials in the tunnel at half time. Well, I've seen Wayne Rooney call a ref a "feckin cnut" to his face during a match, I've also seen several other players swearing at refs - on this occasion Fabregas may or may not have sworn at the ref but it can't have been so shocking, so outrageous otherwise the ref would have included it in his match report. He didn't. So that makes this whole story another fat zero.
Oh yes, Fabregas dived - I've acknowledged he went down a bit easy once, I've not seen him diving. I have seen him running with the ball, knowing full well that someone is going to foul him, which has gained time at the end of the game or a decent free kick when we needed it. That makes him a clever footballer in my eyes.
I've already "addressed" the card-waving incident - so what else is it that Fabregas has done to make everyone "except Arsenal fans of course" dislike him, eh? EH?

Well you've highlighted a number of reasons yourself there and if you look back through the thread there's more and there's other stuff aswell.This isn't just about the other night, it's been going on for ages.

As for the footballing side, I don't accept your view that most people haven't seen him play football because they haven't seen him live. That's just silly. Of course people have seen him play football and nobody questions his ability. Yes, I know that you see things live that aren't necessarily shown on camera but I don't understand what point you're trying to make.

I bet that if he didn't play for Arsenal you'd have a very different opinion of him. I don't expect you to admit that on here though.

jpr60 wrote:

Tilton wrote:

jpr60 wrote:If our captain is not allowed to question the ref/linesman who is?
I don't recall the likes of Roy Keane, John Terry etc holding back when they didn't agree with e refereeing decision and last night's decision-making was pretty poor throughout, especially, of course allowing an offside goal.
I want Cesc to fight our cause - he gets criticism for not being a "real leader" on the pitch - as captain he has the right to talk to the ref and if it includes telling him he's a load of bollox, well so be it. The lad cares - so do I!

You raised the issue of respect in another thread.

Do you think that Fabregas shows respect towards officials on and off the field of play? Either by his seemingly constant questioning of decisions, abuse aimed towards them and attempts to fool them by diving to gain unfair advantages?

Do you think that Fabregas shows respect for his fellow professionals by brandishing imaginary cards and trying to get them booked? Or again by diving etc.?

Undoubtedly he's an excellent footballer but as captain of Arsenal he doesn't set a great example in my opinion.

Since we don't know what "abuse" Fabregas is supposed to have used to the "officials" last night I'm not about to make any judgement - all I know is the match officials were p!ss poor and we could have been giving ManU another two or three points advantage at the top of the table as a result of their inability to control the match properly.
Yes, Fabregas made the card signal to the ref against Huddersfield, probably because one of his team had been shown a red card for an apparent last-ditch foul early in the game whereas a Huddersfield player, stopping Bendtner illegally in the penalty area was allowed to remain on the pitch - that's consistency right there. However, I agree it's not something I like to see but, again, it's understandable given the circumstances.
Diving? Well I wouldn't say Fabregas "dives", he went down a little easy against Birmingham but, then again he wasn't appealing for a pen so maybe he lost his footing as a challenge came in.
As captain of Arsenal Fabregas has the responsibility of looking after stuff on the field of play. If he's fighting for us I'm happy, if he's keeping schtum and letting everyone get away with whatever I'm not happy. I'm happy with Captain Cesc!

Are you Wenger in disguise? Your so blinkered it's painful.

All I can say is that I suppose I'm grateful for this "down" on things Arsenal - if it's not the manager it's the captain - it must mean we're doing something right.
Not sure of the real reasons why we're getting shot down by people in the media and, apparently other clubs fans but I suggest a combination of hypocrisy, xenophobia and good old-fashioned jealousy would be in the mix but, as I say, I'm taking it as a positive. It worked for George Graham, let's hope it works for Arsene Wenger too!

ans you only just noticed ????????

jpr60 wrote:All I can say is that I suppose I'm grateful for this "down" on things Arsenal - if it's not the manager it's the captain - it must mean we're doing something right.
Not sure of the real reasons why we're getting shot down by people in the media and, apparently other clubs fans but I suggest a combination of hypocrisy, xenophobia and good old-fashioned jealousy would be in the mix but, as I say, I'm taking it as a positive. It worked for George Graham, let's hope it works for Arsene Wenger too!

Poor me another.. Everyone agrees that Arsenal are a superb Football team, that your manager is one of the best and will (quite rightly) go down as one of the greats. They also agree that your captain is a superb player.. That's not in doubt. The problem is there is a massive blame culture with the fans and the supporters, 'oh well he only spat at him 'cause..' 'the only reason he swore at him is because..'. Your manager and captain are superb at what they do, but constantly make themselves come across as dickheads by blaming everyone and everything else, rather than shouldering the responsibility every now and then.

villanfromluton wrote:QB, I think Jak is on about the Bryan 'pop' Robson who played up front for Newcastle and West Ham in the 1970's.

Robson was a top midfielder, though remember being at the Hawthorns when Atkinson played him as a sweeper behind the centre backs of Wile and Robertson. One of the best performances I have ever seen from a defender.

Thanks for that. Pop.

Moyes is a wanker. Hasn't even got the balls to say what Fabregas, supposedly, said. Just a smoke screen to hide his own failings. Fecking Jock fairy who did his bollocks at the referee following the Man U game earlier this season.
What a fecking hypocrite!!!!!
Tuesday night was a load of bollocks, a lot about nothing.